Agenda and minutes

Venue: Beckenham Library, Beckenham, BR3 4PE

Contact: Stephen Wood  020 8313 4316

No. Item




Apologies were received from Councillors Stephen Wells, Vanessa Allen and Michael Rutherford.


Apologies were also received from Dr John Parker, Lorraine McQuillan, Derek Sampson, Stephen Parkin, Cliff Watkins and Gillian Morphy. 


Apologies were received the following day from Mr Richard Comaish.




The minutes of the previous meeting on 16th November 2017 were agreed and signed as a correct record.  




CSD 18011


The Group noted the Matters Arising report, and the actions that had either been completed or were ongoing.  




A list of  approved tables and chairs licences that have been issued to premises in Beckenham will be provided prior to the meeting.



Mr Toby Smith (Head of Street Enforcement) and Marieke Brown (Market and Street Trading Enforcement Officer) attended the meeting to provide an update and to answer any related questions. A written report concerning the ‘Use of Footways in Beckenham’ had been drafted by Mr Smith, and Ms Brown had provided a list of businesses in the high street that had been issued with licences to use A-Boards or to place tables and chairs in the footway for al fresco dining.


The Group noted that A-Boards were used to promote the services of the business. The A-Boards should be placed in such a way that they did not block the footway, and could not be placed in the Highway. A business could also apply to the Council for a licence to place tables and chairs on the footway. If tables and chairs were placed on the footway without a licence, then legal action could be taken against the business. Licences were not required for private forecourts.


Mr Nick Goy mentioned problems relating to sufficient pavement space when children and young people were coming out of school.  Mr Smith informed the Group that an application to place tables and chairs in the footway would not be granted as a matter of course. The issuing of the licence would be subject to an inspection.


LBB would seek spare width on the pavement of between 1.5m to 2m to allow the public to walk through unhindered. It would normally be a condition that the tables and chairs would be barricaded. Ms Brown informed the Group that the cost of a licence for a business was £2050.00 per annum, or £1025.00 for six months. 


Mr Goy produced 4 photos of businesses that he felt may be undertaken al fresco dining outside of the legal parameters. He asked if the relevant distances were displayed on the Council website. They were not displayed currently. Mr Goy asked if the information concerning the measurements could be displayed on the Council website. Mr Smith stated that this was something that he would need to investigate. In the meantime he suggested that if there were any issues, members of the Group could email him directly. 


Councillor Sarah Philips asked if incorporated into the conditions would be a requirement to use ashtrays for smokers, and to ensure that the area was cleaned subsequently. Ms Brown confirmed that this was normally part of the conditions for the licence. The Environment Portfolio Holder advised that enforcement action could be taken against a person observed dropping cigarettes in public places instead of disposing of them in the correct manner.


The Chairman wondered what the hours were with respect to street cleaning and asked if this could be clarified. Mr Smith stated that Ward Security could be asked to undertake extra patrols in designated areas if required. With respect to complaints and enforcement action, businesses would be contacted first and spoken to before any enforcement action was considered. The Council had to take reasonable steps  ...  view the full minutes text for item 177.




The update on the cleaning of granite in the vicinity of Beckenham Junction was given by Mr Kevin Munnelly (LBB Head of Renewal).


A visit had been undertaken on site with the current cleaning contractor. The mechanism for cleaning the granite was discussed along with cleaning materials. It seemed that jet washing was still the best solution. A pricing programme for the cleaning was being drafted, but had not been received yet. The cleaning of the granite would commence within the vicinity of Beckenham Junction Train Station. It was anticipated that all of the Major Scheme work would be completed by November 2018.


It was reported that an initial jet washing of the new surface took place after each section was completed. This was undertaken by FM Conway. Going forward, any power jet washing would be undertaken by specialist cleaning contractors using highly trained operatives with the correct cleaning materials.


The cleaning of the granite would have to be undertaken on a regular basis as sweeping clean was not sufficient to keep the granite in the best condition. This additional cleaning had been accounted for in the current scheme budget, until the new cleaning contract bids were considered by the Council. 


It was agreed that the matter of cleaning the granite would stay on the agenda for the next meeting.


Jackie Groundsell asked if the cleaning costs could have been less if the correct granite had been laid originally. Mr Munnelly stated that this was not clear. Ms Groundsell also asked if jet washing the granite was detrimental to the granite and the answer to this was no. Sarah Niblock requested that any cleaning of granite could not take place at night. Mr Munnelly gave assurances that a cleaning programme would be implemented by the next meeting.


Marsha Berg highlighted the issue of prevention, and suggested that the area outside of the kebab shop should be cleaned every night. Mr Munnelly stated that it may be prudent to re-look at the issue of keeping the surface outside of the kebab shop clean. It may be the case that the area outside of the shop should be re-surfaced with darker materials. The issue of chewing gum outside of the kebab shop was also raised. 


Councillor Alan Collins asked if cleaning was undertaken outside of Patrick’s Bar, O’Neil’s and the Bridge Bar. The Chairman responded that the Council cleaned up every day


Mr Goy complained that the cleaning test requested by the Working Group at the last meeting had not been undertaken (Minute 165, 16th Nov 2017). Power washing with mechanical action and detergent was needed to assess the situation before laying any more granite. He requested using red brick terracotta paving instead.


RESOLVED that the matter of cleaning the granite remain as an item for the next agenda. 





The Major Scheme update commenced with an appraisal of the current position regarding the designs that had been submitted for the Beckenham Green canopy. Fourteen submissions had been received, and copies of the submissions were tabled for the attention of the Group. The submissions were from young people who were architectural students. The submissions were discussed by the Group and feedback was provided.


Mr Alan Old was pleased with the quality of the entries, and the work and effort that must have gone into producing them. Sylvia Ramos (LBB Project Planner) explained that the judging of the entries would be undertaken by the Town Centre Team (TCT). The TCT would be assisted by the Conservation Officer and by a representative from Idverde, the Green’s landscape contractor. Mr Munnelly mentioned that ongoing maintenance costs would have to be considered and agreed before the successful design was chosen.


It was suggested that consideration be made to receiving feedback from St George’s Church and any relevant stakeholders. A shortlist would be drawn up and the successful entry would win a prize of £500.00. Selection criteria would be produced to assist the TCT panel, and a recommendation would be made. It was agreed that Mr Munnelly would report back to the Working Group. 


The Group heard that the deadline for a decision on the winning submission was 5th February. A Project Board would make the final decision. Mr Goy asked if the public could vote on the submissions via the web, or via displays set up in public buildings. The Chairman responded that time would not allow this, as faster movement was required. Alan Old felt that the public should be told about the other designs after the winner had been chosen.


It was noted that the next market on the Green was scheduled for 26th May 2018.


Helen McConnell (FM Conway) commenced by informing the Group that Stage 3 of the 6 stages of the major scheme work would be completed in about three weeks time. Work had also just commenced on Stage 4 in the vicinity of Thornton’s Corner. It was noted that outside Foxtons, there were additional problems with drainage and major ground works.


The Group was pleased to note that the views of local businesses had been taken into consideration and that parking had not been suspended outside of WH Smiths.


Councillor Stephen Wells had emailed the Chairman to say that during the recent Christmas period when two way traffic was restored, all the junctions worked perfectly, including when two buses sought to pass. It was comforting to note that the traffic engineers had been proved right in their assessments.


Mr Goy commented that at Thornton’s Corner the 227 bus had to swing out and was going over the central line. Helen McConnell responded that the traffic scheme had been designed for such manoeuvres TfL had not received any complaints from their drivers. Councillor Alan Collins mentioned an incident where a push bike (apparently belonging to an  ...  view the full minutes text for item 179.




Mr Stephen Oliver (LBB Senior Project Planner) stated that a planning application for the new telephone boxes would be submitted on 9th February. The Group heard that it was proposed that the new telephone boxes be located in more appropriate locations and that they were aesthetically pleasing to the eye. The Chairman requested that there be a digital community notice board on one side of the new telephone boxes. It was confirmed that as part of the deal, New World Telecom would remove and make good the sites of their old boxes.


Susan Ryall expressed the view that the telephone boxes should be equipped with free public Wi-Fi. Mr Munnelly responded that the Council could not enforce the equipping of the boxes with Wi-Fi.


Ms Groundsell commented that some retailers would be opposed to the installation of Wi-Fi as it would encourage the sale of goods and services online rather than in store. 




The TCT had nothing to report on this occasion.


ANY OTHER BUSINESS (Previously Notified)


An update on heritage plaques was provided by Mr David Wood. A photograph of the proposed plaque design was passed around the table. The Group noted the design, which included the Beckenham Shield. It was noted that although the photo was of a grey/blue plaque, the proposed plaques would be a bronze colour. The question that required to be answered was how many would LBB finance. There were 24 plaques in total in the original Heritage Trail booklet. The Chairman expressed the view that he would like to see all 24 plaques installed. 


Mr Munnelly stated that at the present time he was not able to confirm how many plaques the Council would be able to fund, but it was very unlikely that the Council would commit to funding for 24 plaques.  A vote was taken with respect to what wording to use at the top of the plaque. The two choices proposed were, ‘A Walk Around Beckenham’ and ‘The Beckenham Heritage Trail’. There was a slight preference for ‘The Beckenham Heritage Trail’ but there were also a lot of abstentions.


It had previously been asked if the term ‘LBB’ should be included on the plaque design. Mr Jonathan Laidlaw expressed the view that the term ‘LBB’ should not be included on the basis that many people would not be aware of what it meant. A similar view was expressed with respect to including the abbreviation ‘TCT’ (Town Centre Team) on the plaque. 


Mr Garry Warner (LBB Head Highways and Traffic Management)  suggested that the number of characters on the plaque should be reduced and that a coloured crest was not possible. It was agreed that the matter of plaques should be included as an agenda item for the next meeting. Chloe-Jane Ross suggested using a graphic designer or typesetter to help with the plaque design.


RESOLVED that an update on heritage plaques be brought to the next meeting.  




The date of the next meeting was confirmed as Thursday, March 29th 2018 at 7.30pm.


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